Updating post from Reddit.
Ok so here’s the situation, a while back a couple moved in they now have 2 kids and the lady is now on housing benefits so that’s how she pays us rent.
The mortgages increased and now the amount of rent she is paying is less than the mortgage - there was talk of increasing the rent she said no she can’t afford it and therefore we gave her a section 21
She wants us to take her to court because she wants the council to give her a house - I’m wondering is it worth me talking to her and advising her to go to the council and saying she is homeless so that they can house her else where?
The court process is long and currently don’t ideally want to go down it right now but I will if I need to. Is there anything else I can say to her at the moment to maybe convince her to leave (she does want to leave the council have told her to stay)
Thank you for the helpful comments - also just to clarify I’m trying to get this sorted for my parents if I don’t know certain things it’s because I’m only trying to learn now to make sure they are doing things properly.
You can certainly have a conversation with her, but there are only two people who can give possession of the property back to you: the current tenant leaving of their own accord; and a judge. You could go down a cash-for-keys route, but likelihood of getting a Council property is very low. It takes years.
You can certainly issue a Section 21, and then once the two months are up, you can then apply for possession. Yes, it will take time, but that is your legal avenue. The Council will mostly likely advise your tenant to stay in the property until possession is granted by a judge (it is her right to remain in the property until such time).
Potentially going to court is a risk that you assume as part of being a landlord.
>Also yes I know you should never give house to single mum on dss this has been such a hassle lol I learnt the hard way.
That's a foul opinion. Relatively speaking, there may be a greater risk involved compared to other population groups, but a swiping opinion like that is outrageous. You can actively mitigate risks with insurance, registration with associations etc. Do your homework.
The best mitigation to this risk is to not rent to high risk tenants.
Yes the phrase used was in poor taste but in today’s market the sentiment is correct commercially.
Is it outrageous though when the risk so high? Single mother or not, it's the fact she is on benefits. That's automatic no for exactly the issue OP is heaving; she can't afford the rent.
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The two months are up... you should be applying for possession then.
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You need to do your homework.
I usually suggest amateur landlords to join NRLA and read their advice guides etc.
You could hire a eviction specialist solicitor to do the work for you
Ok makes sense thank you
Join the NRLA today - it's around £115 - you will have access to all their resources including a phone line where one of their advisors can talk you through the process.
The council will advise her to stay in the property until you have bailiffs set an eviction date (after securing a court order) and it sounds like she might have already spoken to the council. The council will class her as ‘intentionally homeless’ and refuse to help her if she accepts a ‘cash for keys’ deal, though it’d help her towards her next deposit, so I think would still be worth exploring.
2nd this. She can't make herself homeless. If you don't evict, s21, she can't get help. If she leaves, she will be voluntarily homeless.
From my understanding, If she moves out “voluntarily” ie on the date the S21 expires, the council will state she’s made herself intentionally homeless and will not help her.
You taking her to court for a formal eviction is the only way she will get put into a council house as the best case scenario, or temporary accommodation by the council until a suitable property becomes available.
Start the court process now - make sure you are up to date with everything I.e correctly protected deposits, safety certificates, all legal requirements basically and any of that isn’t correct/up to date, they’ll be able to throw out the S21 and you’ll need to go through it all again.
The council will simply tell her again that they will only consider her application if an order is issued by the court giving a possession date. Her leaving by agreement with you will be classed as intentionally homeless.
You need to apply to court for a possession order on the Section 21, and in the meantime she pays as much as she can to you. You need to watch the arrears, as often tenants decide ‘well Ill just stop paying now, whats he going to do?‘. She needs to know that arrears will be pursued.
99% chance it will happen, I've experienced this a few times already
On balance, it is better not to be a landlord. As rights are swinging even further in the direction of tenants, now is the time to sell up.
I agree after tenant leaves we’re thinking of selling
Unfortunately you will need to go through the motions. Council won’t help. It’s a broken system which relies on landlords to help them out. Is she still paying some rent? If she is then at least just ride it out till eviction. Did you have any insurance to cover legal and repossessions?
You will need to follow the full eviction process. Make sure all documentation is correct to not slow the process. Your S21 needs to be valid from the start.
You will likely have to get to the stage of a court eviction, and the council will call you along the way asking you to delay as they have something in the pipeline. In my experience, don’t fall for it and tell them that you’ll follow the pre-determined timelines and that’s the timeline they have to work to.
It took 8 months for me to evict in a similar situation and the council found them a property as I was about to apply for bailiffs to evict.
Good luck
The council likely won't consider her an urgent case until the court tell her to give back the property. If they were to hand back the keys before court, the council could well consider her "intentionally homeless" and put her right at the bottom of the list.
Truth is, she needs you to take her to court because the council won't do anything until after the very last minute. And you need to take her to court to get the property back.
Thing is she has two young kids under age of 5 so I would’ve thought they would still help her
Not until she has no other options. The council knows that court can take months. They're using you to buy them time. They'll literally tell your tenant to stay in place until court or they won't help her.
maybe offer her a bit of money to leave.
This wouldn't help them get a council house though. I think the only way they will leave is the s21 route unfortunately. Basically you can try give them money to move out but where would they be able to rent?
They won't get a council house anyway, they'll get placed somewhere by the council tho and onto the system towards getting eventually a housing association place.
It's the recommended route for the tenant to do this.
Yeah I did a s8 for mine because they stopped rent from the moment they moved in and I wasn't able to s21. I also thought this meant the council wouldn't help because they made themselves homeless but fast forward a few months after eviction and they got housed by the council. So I guess there is a myth that making yourself homeless makes councils not care.
It's not that they don't care or won't help. It's just a different track, they will be far less likely to get a permanent place coming off rent arrears. Council would still offer temp stuff. If its the council they owe they won't be able to get onto the system to bid for places in most circumstances. There's also the option they moved to say a relative/friends in between, who then made them unintentionally homeless by saying they couldn't stay there anymore.
You could offer cash for keys. I’ll pay you £X (less than or equal to court costs ideally) to move out. Making sure you don’t pay until they’ve signed a notice to quit and have actually moved out. That is legal.
Legally, a section 21 doesn’t actually change anything for a tenant. It’s a notice that you intend to seek possession. It’s not in any form an eviction. To the council, she still has a place to live, and so isn’t a concern for them
If she won’t take the money, and won’t move out, your only option is court. This is how the system is designed
Out of curiosity, might be a stupid question, would cash for keys be tax deductible?
I really don’t know tbh, I would think no, but you’d have to consult an accountant
> and advising her to go to the council and saying she is homeless so that they can house her else where?
They will tell her to wait until you have a court order, or even wait until baliffs has been apointed. Its at that point she will be increased priority on the waiting list.
She should get in contact with the council for sure, so they have her on file, but it will make no difference to you.
Your options are to see if she will leave (she isnt), see if she will leave with some incentive (pay her deposit for next rental?) or go to court.
I've been through this process, the drill is: get all your documentation correct Apply for section 21 Wait for 2 months Apply for court repossession order without a hearing needed Wait another 2 to 4 months until the case is judged hopefully without a hearing, if there is a hearing because they claimed hardship or another excuse can delay it further Apply for bailiff's to repossess May need to wait another 1 or 2 months to get it booked
Never rent to someone on benefits again, only take professionals with guarantors and use insurance on top and keep your property.
Take the section 21 off the table and just issue a section 13 notice of the rent increase, if she doesn’t pay it then issue out a CCJ, non payment of rent will stop her getting a council house or another property. This will potentially make her be more motivated to find somewhere else.